Stage Violinist to Doctor with Rheumatologist Dr. Siobhan (ViolinMD)

KKH Trailer Wide


Will: [00:00:00] Knock,

knock, hi. Welcome to knock, knock. Hi. With the glockenspiel, I feel like I came in a little bit too hot. Little jelly. Knock, knock. Hi, I am Dr. Glockenspiel. I am Lady Glockenspiel. And we’re talking music today. We’re talking about music and medicine and comedy and like all the things, but, uh, a lot about music because we have a very special guest.


Kristin: lots of people. Oh 

Will: man. So many people have asked us to have, uh, violin MD, Dr. Siobhan DeShower, uh, a YouTube, uh, a huge name in the medical YouTube, uh, realm. What have you sphere community? I don’t know. What do you want to call it? She is a [00:01:00] staple and makes unbelievable content. Yeah, a really, really great conversation about making content about, uh, her background, uh, which is, it’s fascinating because she was a professional.

Violinist. Yeah. Turned internal medicine rheumatologist. Uh, YouTube. That’s 

Kristin: right. You don’t hear that very often. That’s a very unique combination. She may be the 

Will: only one. Possibly. Possibly the only violinist. 

Kristin: Rheumatologist. YouTuber. 

Will: Now, it did make me think, talking to her made me think about my own experience in music.

Uh, by the way, uh, you get to hear me sing a little bit with, kind of, not really sing. If you can call it that. I don’t know if you can call it. Yeah, that’s later in the episode. You made some noise. I made 

Kristin: noises. With your mouth hole. 

Will: So we both have a background in instrument playing. We both come 

Kristin: from pretty musical families.

Will: That’s right. My dad, uh, was a trombone [00:02:00] player in high school and college. Shout out to Texas Tech Goin Band from Raiderland and I played trombone and my brother played trombone. We all have very long arms. Well, and your brother… So trombone is a very natural thing for us. That’s true. And my brother is a, uh, my younger brother is…

He took it the farthest. Yeah. He actually majored in trombone performance, music performance, and is a band director. And he also 

Kristin: was in the golden band from 

Will: Raiderland. He was also in there. I was the only one that that tapped out and I, I, I peeked in high school. I decided I didn’t want to do, you know, play an instrument anymore.

Kristin: Well, you had enough hot air. You could have made it work. 

Will: Oh, nice. That’s good. I say, are you thinking that because we just went to the hot Air balloon festival? It could be. It’s you got hot air on your mind. Fresh on my mind, yeah. And you were a flute player? I was AFL test. Mm-hmm. . Yeah. I’d say that’s probably on my top five most annoying instruments to listen to.

How dare you? I’m sorry to all the flute players, but I just, I don’t [00:03:00] know. Something about the, the high pitch, the, I don’t know, I just, no, it’s got the full. 

Kristin: Musical range. 

Will: I’m impressed by flute players. Because it seems really hard because you got Some fast fingers. Real 

Kristin: fast fingers. Trombone is much more of like a gross instrument.

It’s just gross movements. Yeah, big 

Will: room in and out kind of thing. Yeah, 

Kristin: not gross like disgusting. Although the spit valve is pretty disgusting. I will say. Don’t you 

Will: have a spit valve too? No. You’re blowing air. It’s it just stays 

Kristin: in the flute and then you have a little a little yeah I still got to clean it out that you put in there that it just absorbs it all you never really have to deal with It too much.

Yeah, and 

Will: I think it’s not actually spit so much maybe a little bit but it’s like 

Kristin: condensation. Yeah, right I mean, there’s gotta be some spit in there. 

Will: Some little bit of spit And, and anyway. Well, this took a turn. 

Kristin: Yeah. So, the point is. You know where there’s no spit is in 

Will: violence. That’s right. That’s one of the advantages.

Unless you’re 

Kristin: really doing it wrong. [00:04:00] 

Will: Oh, man. We’ve been recording for quite a while today. All right. Uh, so. Um, let’s, should we get to our guests? I think we’d better. I think we do. And people are tired of hearing us talk about our own instruments. Uh, do you miss playing the flute? I do 

Kristin: sometimes. Yeah. I, I.

You really? No, I really do sometimes. Yeah. Do you still have that? No, I gave it to my brother cause he, he’s the, the musical savant in our family. He’s the one that took it the furthest. He can play all sorts of instruments. He’s in like bands in Austin. I don’t know if he still is. He’s got, he’s got a kid now and another one on the way.

So he’s busy doing other 

Will: things, but. Hey, if you guys know, the people listening, which uh, instruments we should get our kids doing? Anybody have any recommendations? Anybody have any things they think 

Kristin: they’re I want them to do piano. They’ve got your long fingers. So I, and they both have like You know, dabbled in it, so.

Yeah, we do have a keyboard. I always wished I could play piano, and I tried, but my fingers are too short. Yeah, you got, you got a little… Little stubby sausages. [00:05:00] Yeah, they’re like sausage fingers. I think 

Will: I, I think I, I think I mentioned that in our vows. I think, yeah, probably. I, it’s like, 

Kristin: when I actually went I was like,

Will: Well, listen, my wife, she’s got these sausage fingers. What would you recommend? They’re really small, but they’re still sausages. I, but I, it’s very, it wasn’t just the, the fingers. It was also, uh, find me the cheapest ring that still 

Kristin: looks nice. I think we’re still paying that off. Cause you 

Will: used your med school loan.

I used a med school loan to pay. Okay. We’re really talking about a lot of things here, but anyway, yes. To wrap that up, I did. Pay for your engagement ring with a med student, med school. We had no other choice. That’s all we had. So at this point, the ring, which at the time I think cost, it costed like 1, 200, I believe it was, which was the most money I’d ever spent at that point in my life.

Uh, but with interest and everything, it’s probably like 37, 000. Right. That is still[00:06:00] 

Kristin: the most

Will: expensive thing I’ve ever bought. I think I need an upgrade then. 37, MD on YouTube. Definitely check her out fantastic rheumatologist

in Canada, practices in Ontario. So let’s get to it. Here is Dr. DeShower.

All right. We have Dr. Shaban DeShower. Am I saying that correctly? Yeah, 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: you are. Is that right? 

Will: Yeah. I want to make sure I get your last name. Okay. All right. Well, you’re speaking, you’re speaking to Dr. Glockenflecken here. So, uh, you know, I, I’m no. I’m no stranger to strange names, but, um, uh, so we’re so excited to have you on.

Thank you for joining us. A YouTube extraordinaire here. [00:07:00] Um, and, uh, someone that I’ve been watching on YouTube, uh, for quite a while now. So thank you for being here. 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Oh, my pleasure. I would say the same thing about you guys. I’ve watched so many of your videos and finally chatting with you. It’s fantastic.

I’m really looking forward to it. I will 

Will: say that right before we got on and started talking with each other, Um, I was watching a video where somebody’s, uh, spleen died after going to the dentist, uh, and which I found quite fascinating. I knew you would like that one. It’s one of your videos from, I don’t know how long ago it was, but uh, if you remember making that one.

Yeah. I love the storytelling. The, um, your content is just, it’s really fascinating. You can tell how engaged your audience is as well. So congratulations on all of the success that you’ve had building up your YouTube channel. Oh, 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: thank you so much. Yeah, definitely one of these things that you start out and you have no clue where things are going to end up and such a fun iterative process.

Let’s start 

Will: there. What, what was the, cause [00:08:00] I know you started your, your social media content, your presence as a first year resident. What was it that kind of sent you on that path? 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Yeah, great question. I mean, you’d think I’d have a really good answer at this point, but like most big decisions in life, there’s not one moment that kind of led me there.

Um, instead, I think going through medicine, especially as like a non traditional student, I came from a violin background as a professional violinist before, and then switching things up, going into medicine, I was so often texting my friends saying, Did you know like this about our body? Or did you know this could happen?

And a lot of my friends non medical were like, what the heck? I had no idea. And I started thinking, okay, well, we’re not the only ones who didn’t know these things. It’d be really cool to somehow spread this. And then also. be able to sort of, I don’t know, mark or take moments to, to pause in this journey and really [00:09:00] reflect on it.

Because as you guys know, I mean, it is, you’re seeing life, death, excitement, horror, and you’re trying to process all of it. So I thought this would kind of be a way. And at first I thought, okay, well, I’ll just, I’ll start a blog, you know, I’ll write about it. But that sort of felt like a school assignment and nothing ever felt perfect enough to put out there.

I was like, oh, okay, what am I going to do? So I thought, well, what about a video? I’d never edited a video in my life. But I filmed myself a lot as a violinist, you know, you film yourself performing, watch it back. And so I felt oddly comfortable just talking on camera. And so I thought, okay, maybe this is the way to do it and didn’t think much of it.

Um, I, you know, just, just gave it a shot and figured the beginning of residency was the beginning of this next part of this crazy journey. So it felt like a good time. 

Will: Well, you, you tapped into something that I think a lot of. A lot of people in medicine who are starting to make content have, have [00:10:00] figured out, which is there’s a huge gap knowledge gap between the general public and like what we all know as physicians, right?

And, and it, I think it takes, um, uh, a lot of, uh, time and, and, and energy to figure out how to bridge that gap, uh, which is something I think you do really well, like nobody knows about eyeballs. I mean, nobody, not even. Non ophthalmologists know about eyeballs, but I’m just like, I don’t know anything about rheumatology, but, uh, um, I think trying to, to, to take what we know about the human body, right.

And, and turn it into something that is digestible for the general public is so important. Uh, and, um, is that your, is that your approach when you make a video? Is that what you’re going for? 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Yeah, I think it’s a combination of trying to be, I don’t know, maybe transparent, like when I think about healthcare, so much happens behind closed doors.

And, you know, I [00:11:00] very much remember not having much of a clue about what goes on in a hospital. It doesn’t feel like that long ago. So, and even the language, right? Years to learn this language ourselves. And I remember what it was like not to understand that stuff. Um, and we’re often dealing with such scary things, right?

Like death and, you know, a disease that will affect your life, your quality of life. And so I think finding a way to make this. less scary, open up the doors, whether that means bringing a camera into the hospital and saying, okay, yeah, like we’re people we’re doing the best we can. We’re eating pizza in the back room while we’re working, you know, like all of these experiences bring people in rather than keeping those doors closed.

And then in that process, being able to speak to a general audience, because that’s what I love. You know, I love being able to, to talk in a way that people are going to understand. And I love the feedback you get from that. It’s really starting a conversation. Yeah. And you 

Kristin: said something that I think is so important, which is that you remember what it felt like [00:12:00] not to know those things.

And I think that is uncommon when you’re dealing with, you know, people who are experts in their field, whether it’s medicine or something else, you know, there’s this idea of the curse of knowledge, which is that you forget what it’s like to not know what you know. And I’ve encountered that a lot as a patient, right, of, You know, sometimes, you know, when we’re getting updates, like, for example, when he was in the ICU and, um, they would give me some daily updates.

I was at home because of COVID. Um, so I’d get a phone call and they’d tell me some things, but I had all these questions about the. Parts they didn’t tell me right because to them they already knew okay We’ve ruled out certain things as a concern And so those are just kind of not worth talking about right unless they had been a concern and there’d been some test Right, but just the things that they knew right off the bat were not a concern.

Well, I didn’t know that you know, or I didn’t know what the language is. So I think that is so important. Um, [00:13:00] because when physicians don’t, you know, what, what you don’t say is as important as what you do say, because if patients are wondering about things and you don’t address it, it leaves us to our imagination and to misunderstandings and misinformation.

So I think that’s really awesome that you still remember that and incorporate that into your videos. 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Yeah, I mean, I think the big challenge is going to be now going forward, trying to hold on to that. And I think maybe that’s one of the benefits of kind of like being in this YouTube world now is that I’ve got a bit of a check because I get to see in the comments, what did that mean?

What did you mean by that? And it goes, Oh, right. Okay. Right. You know, the viewers are generally helping me kind of keep that mindset. And I’m grateful for that because it is so easy to slip into jargon and think. Everyone knows that, right? 

Kristin: Right. Yeah. Even words like code, right? I didn’t know what it meant to code, but people kept saying that and it just was confusing, you know, so we need a lot more of that in, in healthcare.

[00:14:00] People that, that remember, you know, what it’s like not to know and, and how to talk to people who are beginners in this 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: area. And I wish you never knew what that was. I also 

Will: get… Oh, I know, yeah. I also get content ideas from my, from my comment section on social media, so… Yeah, right? It’s great. In fact, sometimes they, people, people, yeah.

Sometimes people comment things and I’m like, Oh man, that’s a good joke. I wish I would have put that in my, in my skit. Uh, it’s, uh, somewhat infuriating at times, but much appreciated. That’s why I think YouTube is so special, right? It’s a, it’s a fun, um, it’s a fun community where you can have a little bit more back and forth and, and hear.

Your audience’s thoughts on what you’re, what it is you’re creating. I feel like you don’t get that as much and on some of the other platforms. 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. So hopefully kind of we get to see how the [00:15:00] public thinks and then we get to share maybe how doctors think we can kind of bridge that gap a little bit because often it can feel massive.


Will: I, I don’t want to gloss over like something you mentioned earlier. You just kind of threw it out there. Like it was like, Oh yeah, I used to be a violinist, to be a professional violinist, uh, you know, whatever. No big deal. It’s just like a thing I did just like you’re going to check the mail. Uh, and so, uh, I, I, I’ve been wanting, this is one thing I’ve been wanting to talk with you about and why I was so excited to have you on, uh, because I think, um, God, we need like.

Artistry and creativity and medicine and people that, that have that experience, I think is so valuable. So, can you tell us about, uh, well, first of all, how old were you when you started playing violin? 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Oh, I had one of those tiny, tiny violins. I was four and a half, five years old, you know, like basically just like a tiny squeak as you’re trying to play.


Will: 11 year old is… [00:16:00] Interested in violin and so we’re we’re probably going to go that route. How difficult was it for your parents to listen to you? Learning to play the violin. 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Oh my goodness. You know what they they will probably tell you that it was a joy But I don’t know for sure I I was So lucky that both my parents were incredibly supportive of it.

Um, my mom was always the one practicing with me, like when I was little. So I think she got the brunt of, I don’t want to, and all that attitude. Whereas my dad is a super accomplished pianist. And so we grew up, like, I grew up playing with him all the time. So he got the fun part of going up and performing and getting all the applause.

But my mom is really the unapplauded one who should get the credit for getting me to actually practice when I was young. 

Kristin: Yeah. Isn’t that how it always goes? 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Right? Exactly. 

Will: So, so, so you, at some point you made the decision [00:17:00] to pursue Uh, the violin as a profession and so how long, I guess, how old were you, like, when did that happen and how long did you, you know, do.

Be a professional. How long did you work as a professional violinist trying to figure out how to say this? 

Kristin: I think you just stroked out a 

Will: little bit Well, how long did you do this before deciding to switch gears? Yeah Well, you 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: know what a pretty long time because if you think about it It’s not as much, I mean, your career really starts even when you’re still back in high school, when you’re competing, you’re leading orchestras, you’re playing concertos with orchestras.

It just was so much a part of my life. Like I was so fortunate to be able to travel around the world with my violin and play and meet people. And it just enriched my life. So much, and it was such a big part of my identity, too. Like, I was Siobhan, who was kind of the, you know, the funny spelling name who played the violin.

Like, that [00:18:00] is, you know, how you would identify me. And, um, and I loved it. I absolutely loved it. Met so many cool people. Learned so much about myself. And so going to university, it, I mean, I did consider, do I want to pursue music, but it didn’t feel like a difficult decision. I knew I was trying to reach a certain level.

Like, um, I think I would describe it as you sort of dream the sound that you want to create. And I was so focused on being able to create that sound to be able to be comfortable on stage, like get to that place. Um, so it was a no brainer. I was like, of course I’m going to study. And I wanted to study.

With one particular professor, Mauricio Fuchs. It was like my dream. I ended up going down to Indiana University. Phenomenal experience. And I was, got to like see sororities, fraternities up close. It was like legally blonde in real life. Um, totally different culture than Canada. Um, but it was great. It was great.

And [00:19:00] I was, I don’t know, I was so focused. It almost felt like I was just underwater. And just like, you know, couldn’t hear anything else, just this one thing in front of me. And then there was this point and I don’t know exactly when it was that it almost felt like I came up like out of the water and looked around at this huge big world and thought, wow, there is so much out there.

And I have been a violinist that’s been such a main part of my life for so long. And when I’m on stage. I don’t know if it’s at all similar with when comedy, it might be different because you’re getting more input back from the audience, but I felt sort of separated from the audience. And I know the impact that music has on me, on other people.

It’s so profound. And there was something telling me that I wanted to, I don’t know the right word, like to have more of a direct impact or engage with people in a different way. I was sort of ready for something different. And I didn’t know that different thing [00:20:00] was me, like was medicine. At first I was just sort of figuring out how am I going to have this conversation with my professor because it’s such a challenge so it was really only in the last year of my undergrad that I really started thinking about switching to something else and then I moved back to Canada and decided to try out different things.

So I worked with the Toronto Symphony Orchestra. Got to go on tour with them. It was meet amazing musicians and really kind of be steeped in that. But at the same time, down the road, I was going and taking science courses at University of Toronto. And, um, I actually pitched a research idea to this surgeon because of course I thought with my hands, if I’m going to do anything, I’ll probably be a surgeon.

Um, and I decided to interview. people who had done similar switches. I wish I’d included comedians, but I included sort of military personnel and, um, professional athletes, professional musicians to look at [00:21:00] what, what kind of skills did you learn in those other fields that you’re bringing to your medical practice?

Um, and after talking to all these Really cool people, like doing amazing things, uh, I just thought, wow, this is what I want to do. Medicine is awesome and I applied to medical school and was fortunate enough to get in. So yeah, it was, it was, uh, not as not, not certain. You know, I hear a lot about a lot of people who just knew that’s what they wanted to do, but it took me a while.

Will: Yeah, well, uh, it, from a, from a comedy standpoint, you know, uh, if you feel disconnected from your audience, you’re having a bad time, uh, telling jokes because it’s very much, you need, you need some, you need some laughs whenever you’re telling jokes on stage. That’s why like for me. Uh, the pandemic, one of the, one of the ways it was so challenging because I was like, I was like doing these speaking engagements, uh, and all I was, I was just telling jokes into a webcam with everybody in the audience on mute.

And [00:22:00] so it was just like nothing, no feedback whatsoever. So I, I, but I can relate to you in terms of just enjoy, you know, just enjoying being on stage and performing and, and doing that in front of an audience. Do you still get the opportunity to do that? 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Yeah, yes and no. Um, I would say. That in medical school, I was better at the balance and then like I still played with orchestras throughout my training and, um, sort of set up concerts at, um, nursing homes at the hospitals, like doing that type of thing.

And, um. And put on some chamber music concerts as well. But as I went through training and then COVID hitting, it just, ah, so much petered out. And so this is my first year of freedom out of residency. So this is the first year of feeling like I’m really getting back into it. And, and I’m so grateful for that.

Will: So you, um, you did your, where did you do your residency? 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Uh, McMaster University. Here in Ontario, [00:23:00] Canada, for those of you, you know, up that place up north. 

Will: That’s right. It’s a, it’s a big place up north. Um, and so, and, and so you finished your, this is your rheumatology training that you finished. 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Is that right?

Yes, exactly. I don’t know if it’s the same in the States. I think it is where you do three years of internal medicine and then I do two years of rheumatology after that. What 

Kristin: drew you to rheumatology in particular? 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Um, I think probably the mystery, the medical mysteries. Like, I really loved that. Um, and within rheumatology, you don’t, you, you still look at, people as, as a whole, all the organ systems, no offense, but I wasn’t, I wasn’t keen on just like going down into one eyeball or ignoring the rest.

No, no, I know you guys look at the rest of the body, but you know, I, I liked, I know people think of rheumatologists as arthritis doctors and yes, often joints and joint inflammation will bring you in the [00:24:00] door, but I mean, We’re dealing with conditions that affect the whole body so I liked that I get to pull things together.

I like the population and I always found in the hospital, I don’t, I always found that when there was some mystery case that no one could figure out what was going on there was always infectious diseases, hematology, and rheumatology. And so you kind of get to come in and try to pull pieces together. And I just loved it.

I loved it. And still do. 

Will: That’s that. That’s Yeah, that’s why we love you. That’s why we love what you do. Because I love Sending medical mysteries to people like rheumatologists and infectious disease specialists, uh, uh, so I’m glad we have somebody that loves to take those, those types of 

Kristin: things. And I…

Only recently learned what rheumatologists do, but I have a newfound appreciation for them because I have, you know, I am somewhere on the hypermobility spectrum. Uh, somewhere that’s, that’s not good. So, [00:25:00] um, I have recently discovered how much rheumatologists know about that. So that, that, uh, really piques my interest that you, you chose that for your 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: specialty.

Yeah, it is so broad, isn’t it? From, like, mobility, to joints, to weird rashes, like, it’s kind of this mishmash of a lot of things. Right. 

Will: Yeah, speaking of, uh, speaking of weird rashes, actually, you, uh, told us a little bit about yourself here. Uh, I love, I love when people are an open book like you and you’re just like, Hey, let me tell you about this mysterious rash that I had, uh, while I was on the, my ICU rotation.

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Oh, what a, oh man, what a nightmare you can imagine. So like ICU is stressful enough and this you’re, you know, you’re always gowning up, right? You’re always getting into like hot rooms and the hospital scrubs, I hadn’t yet bought my own scrubs. So it was kind of like pandemic time, but this was before then.

thin, tiny, thin scrubs that they give you at the hospital, and [00:26:00] I would sweat through them. And so I was like, this is so embarrassing. You’re not supposed to sweat. Oh, gosh, I need to like, you know, do something about this. So I got this some ad on Instagram. And I thought, okay, maybe I’ll try it out. It’s this shirt that had some like padding that goes under your arms.

I was like, okay, yes, that’s it. Exactly. I think I’m pretty sure that was it. I have those too. Do you? Okay. It worked like a charm, right? It was fantastic. I could like wear all the, you know, silk shirts, even out of work that I loved. Um, but then I got this rash under my arm and I thought. Okay, well, as good as new me as you know, it must be because of this so I’m tossing this that must be the issue But it’s stuck around so I was like, okay.

Well, you know, I’m supposed to be this person who loves mysteries I’m gonna sort this out So I bump into a dermatologist and he says okay. Yeah, no problem Um, you know, I know him did a rotation with him. He says come in. I’ll come come in before 8 a. m And I’ll squeeze you and take a look And I have to say I know it’s unfair.

[00:27:00] I’m really lucky to have that kind of curbside consult for yourself. I’m really grateful. Um, he took a look and he’s like, yeah, it’s dermatitis. Like, okay, yeah, it’s inflammation of the skin. I can see that too. Like what’s causing it? Right. So I was like, okay. Um, so basically the short answer is, well, we’re not quite sure.

Here, take some prednisone, here’s a cream. And it was like, a pretty hefty dose of prednisone, which I normally give to patients, so I know the risks. And it’s like, okay, I’ll give it a try. I’m sure that’ll clear it up. So, I try it out. And lo and behold, it doesn’t go away. I’m like, what the heck? A rash that’s not going away with prednisone?

Are you kidding me? What’s happening? So, okay. 

Will: That’s what that’s the way rashes are supposed to behave, right? Yeah, 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: exactly. And so what it is, what it’s like if it’s not, uh, if prednisone doesn’t work, what do we do? Usually move towards antibiotics, right? It’s just how things work. So I end up, um, I was actually sort of researching away, going on PubMed, trying to figure this out.

At that [00:28:00] time, This was as I was prepping for our wedding, actually. So I was wedding dress shopping and I had this horrible rash and I feel obligated to tell people it’s not contagious. I’m so sorry. Awful. Um, so I am desperate to find an answer. So I’m searching around PubMed and I find this article that was linking the keto diet to these kinds of like keto rashes.

And, um, okay, well, I was trying keto, I must admit, at that time, pre wedding, so I, I figured, okay, well, I’ll up my carb count. And it did go away, but if I missed a meal, or, like, if I just got busy, or carbs dropped, or something, the rash would come back with a fury. And so I found this article that was saying, well, maybe taking an antibiotic and it was this, they did this cohort study in Japan and I was like, okay, I printed it off and I was in a different city because I was on elective there.

And I went to a walk in clinic with my article and I was like, I would like to try this [00:29:00] and you know, had this discussion and the doctor was kind enough to say, okay, yeah, let’s give it a try. So I took that. And again, no improvement. I was like, what the heck? What is happening here? So, in the end, I did exactly what I told all my patients not to do.

Which was to start looking more broadly. You Googled. Yes, Google, exactly. I found this, you know, not a bad website, but not like a reputable one. It’s not peer reviewed, this is not research articles. Someone was just saying, Well, we found that with keto rashes, people have, are eating really high fat content and they’re not sometimes eating enough protein.

So I went back and I calculated all my protein that I was eating and I thought, wow, okay, my protein is actually quite low. So I bumped it up and lo and behold, the rash disappeared. I was like, okay. Why? What is going on? So I, like, I looked and this is where I’m still at. Like, I still, so if anyone out there knows, like, tell me because I [00:30:00] don’t, I don’t have a better answer than if protein, increasing the protein made it go away.

Okay. I’ve got to say it gave 

Will: me. Okay, Siobhan, if. If, if, if, if, let’s be honest, if, if you can’t figure this out as the rheumatologist and the maybe 

Kristin: there’s a hematologist or what was the other 

Will: one, the infectious disease, let’s get them all together in one room and the 

Kristin: Avengers of medicine. 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Yes. Yes, please.

Assemble for me. Oh my gosh. But like, seriously, I feel for. Bizarre. patients when they come in, right? When it’s something that’s not life threatening. Like, I think I’ve got quite a lot of faith in medicine. When it’s life threatening, it’s something big and bad showing up on your blood work. We’re pretty good at figuring it out.

But these things are just annoying and that affect your quality of life, but there’s nothing really tied to it. It’s, it’s humbling to realize that we don’t have the answers. [00:31:00] And especially someone who likes to solve mysteries, that’s like a humbling experience. So yeah, absolutely. Yeah. 

Kristin: I’ve had that experience a lot as a, I only recently realized that I was, you know, I mean, I’ve known I was hyper mobile my whole life I didn’t know that would cause all these problems, right?

And so yeah, I’ve had a plenty of times where I’ve gone in with something and the answer is basically 

Will: Well, I’m and I’m a walking mystery. Yeah, I don’t know why I don’t know why my heart started decided to like, you know short circuit But you know

No, no, never got an answer. Um, it is what it is, I guess. I’ve got my little defibrillator here. It’s going to save the day if it goes off again. But, um, you know, we need to give that thing a name. Do you have to name it? I don’t know. 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: It’s got to be part of the 

Will: suggestions. Yeah, that’s right. Um, but you know, I don’t know.

Sometimes we just. We have [00:32:00] to just throw our hands up and be like, you know, we’ve, we’ve done everything we can try to figure out what’s going on, but you know, we just don’t have an answer and we can try to mitigate, you know, it from happening again, or, you know, treat it the best we can, but there’s lots of mysteries in medicine.

We still can’t figure out. 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Yeah, exactly. 

Will: That’s for, that’s for people smarter than me though. Let’s take a quick break and then we’ll come back with Dr. Siobhan.

Hey Kristen, have I ever told you about Demodex? I’m afraid. Little 

Kristin: eyelid mites. Oh gosh, no, don’t do that. Uh, uh. I’m just 

Will: saying, if you’ve ever had red, itchy, irritated eyes, it could be demodex blepharitis. 

Kristin: You might have some little friends on your eyelids? They’re not quite this big. Well, that’s 

Will: comforting.

To find out more, though, you can go to eyelidcheck. com. That’s E Y E L I D check dot com to find out more information about demodex blepharitis. Don’t freak out. Get checked out. Today’s episode is [00:33:00] brought to you by the Nuance Dragon Ambient Experience, or DAX for short. This is AI powered ambient technology.

It just sits there in the room with you, just helps you be more efficient, and it helps with reducing clinical documentation burden. Yeah, 

Kristin: and that can help you feel less overwhelmed and burnt out and just kind of restore the joy to practicing medicine. 

Will: We all want that. So stick around after the episode or visit Nuance.

DAX. That’s N U A N C E dot com slash discover D A X. A big thank you to all our listeners, spread the love, share this podcast with everyone, you know, every single person, everybody, like every. You know, leave a rating and review. Be honest. You can tell us what you think. We want to improve this thing as we go.

Uh, later today, we’re going to share some of your own medical stories. You can share yours at knock, knock high at human dash content. com. We also have a Patrion coming out with other members of this community, uh, [00:34:00] early episode access. Check out bonus episodes where we react to medical shows and movies.

And it’s just a lot of fun. So come hang out with us.

All right, we are back with Dr. Deshauer and There’s one thing I wanted to ask you about because, uh, you know, coming from a, an arts background, all of a sudden you’re like, you’re throwing yourself into med school. Like that’s gotta be a tough transition. I know that that’s something probably a lot of learner, a lot of students struggle with at least like thinking about doing that.

Like, Oh, can I really make that change? Like, what’s it going to be like? When I like that first couple weeks of med school where you got all these people that are coming from like biology background, like I was intimidated. I was like a cell and molecular biology major. Like I kind of knew what was coming, right?

But I felt kind of bad for like the, the, you know, people that like were art [00:35:00] majors and things who wanted to do medicine, but then were felt like they were a little bit behind. So can you speak a little bit to that experience? Oh, 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: yeah. The sense of feeling behind. I was all over that. That was, uh, it was all there.

I mean, luckily, I sort of knew my personality where I love to know the basics and kind of work in a stepwise fashion. That’s what I prefer. Um, so I did take some undergrad courses before going into medical school, like in the preparation of applying. There’s some, I got to do some, learned that I loved organic chemistry.

Who knew that might have been my alternative major. 

Will: You’re lying. There’s no way. I did not believe you. It was like Lego in your mind. Oh my god, that’s, that’s, that’s impressive. That’s probably the most impressive thing that you’ve just, that you’ve said on this podcast so far. That you love organic. That should go on, that, that’s.

I mean, she is a rheumatologist. Of course, like you could do anything. But, um, even organic chemistry. As a rheumatologist, you [00:36:00] can do anything, even organic chemistry. 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: But like, I kind of wish I’d taken things like anatomy because people came in there knowing so much anatomy and physiology, where I knew pretty much nothing.

And there was actually orientation week. We weren’t even started classes, but you know, it was really fun. They would put us into groups and we did activities. And I still remember this one time we were out. in a park, a beautiful day, they hand us this white t shirt and one person in the group had to put it on.

I’m like, Oh, this is great. Then they give us markers. And first of all, I’m a bad drawer. So I’m already a little nervous. And then they say, Okay, we’re gonna like draw the anatomy. It’ll be fun. Don’t worry, no pressure. And I had terror strike through me because like all of us, right, you want, you’re kind of a perfectionist where you would like to do your best.

You just came out of like premed mindset where you’re like, really striving. Yeah, throat, every point matters. And you haven’t really turned that part off yet to realize, [00:37:00] okay, now I can actually just learn medicine. Um, and I was so scared that they were going to realize like, I didn’t even know where the spleen went.

Like I did not know which side of the body it was. And I was just like, don’t give me that marker. So yeah, it got better. It got better. Did you guess? Did you guess 

Will: correctly? 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: I did the classic evade the eyes. I will not touch that marker. I will not. I will not admit what I don’t know. 

Will: Well, the spleen, you know, that’s, you know, do we really need the spleen?

I know as a rheumatologist, you probably care about the spleen more than I do, but, uh, I don’t know. He 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: can live without it, right? See, 

Will: that’s, that’s what I’m, that’s what I’m saying, yeah. 

Kristin: Don’t tempt him, his body will try. Yeah, well, 

Will: you know. I, I’m just saying, I’d rather have a second liver. That’s, that’s like, what’s the point?

Like, wouldn’t you rather? You know? Have, I 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: don’t know. I’d agree with you. I would agree with you. I still like my spleen. 

Will: Yeah, it’s fine. I guess there’s going to be a lot of spleen [00:38:00] apologists 

Kristin: who are going to be at me in my 

Will: mentions here. Um, okay. Well, I have a little, I devised a little game to play that is like a, a arts and humanities driven game kind of.

Um, in honor of, no, you’ll, you’ll probably do better at this than I, I’m about to embarrass myself tremendously here. Uh, okay. So this is a game. I wanted to try to incorporate like medicine and then music. Uh, and so we’re going to play a game called medical melodies, medical melodies. Okay. Uh, so have you ever, yeah, a little dubious.

Well you should be. You should be. Uh, so. Have you ever played cranium? I think it’s cranium. Do you remember that game? It’s like it’s a board game cranium No, there’s there’s a thing you can do in cranium It’s they’re called humdingers where you you have your teammate hum a song and the person has to guess what the song is Okay, so that’s that’s what [00:39:00] we’re gonna do.

Okay, I am going to hum a song that has a Medical theme to the title. Okay. Oh, no guys. 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Okay. Let’s let’s even try you 

Kristin: better You better make sure that’s entirely true. Is it always the title or is it no the 

Will: song? The subject of the song might not have anything to do with medicine, but the title title the title could maybe sometimes very loosely but still Have a medical tilt to the, the title of the song.

Okay. Okay. Uh, okay. And you’re, you’re gonna guess, you’re gonna help. Okay. Okay. Kristen, Kristen is gonna help. Okay, 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Kristen on my team. I like this. Yeah. 

Will: I can speak. Okay. Yeah, it’s perfect. Okay. Oh, God. All right. I can’t believe I’m doing this. All right. Here’s the first one.

Kristin: Oh, I know. 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Do you [00:40:00] I need more of this beautiful melody. Yeah, I think we should hear a little more . 

Will: What is it? You know what that one is? Staying Alive. Staying Alive by the um, all right. Here’s one.

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: I know it now. I know it as well, but I don’t know the name.

Spoon Sugar. Yes! Spoonful of sugar, that’s right. Well done. 

Will: Oh god, okay. He’s sweating. I am sweating a little bit. Alright, uh, let’s see. Let’s do something, uh, we’ll do something a little bit more… Well no, this one’s I think from like the 80s, I don’t know. Um, alright here we go. Oh god. Um, see this is the other thing.

I don’t know if I’m even doing [00:41:00] this correctly. Okay.

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: I have no idea. I’m totally lost on 

Will: this one. Tainted love. Oh, was it? I still don’t know that one. 

Kristin: I know it, I’ve got to

Will: get away from this. Right, I knew this song. 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Alright, alright. It’s us, it’s not you Will, don’t worry. No, 

Will: it’s absolutely me. Don’t try to make me feel better. She’s Canadian, 

Kristin: that’s what she says. 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Yeah, yeah, I’ve got to apologize on your behalf. 

Will: Okay, okay. Alright, here’s one from like this century. Uh, okay. Uh, hmm hmm hmm.

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Oooo. Bad love. Yes. Bad 

Kristin: blood. Bad love. What am I doing? Bad blood. 

Will: Taylor Swift! Bad… Bad 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: [00:42:00] blood. Blood, right. Okay, yeah. 

Will: Yeah, yeah. Bad blood. I said first. Taylor Swift. Good. Nice. You 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: got it. Hey, where’s my, where’s my Beethoven at? You know? Where’s my Brahms? Yeah. Where are my boys? 

Will: I have not. Your homie. I have, I have zero classical music on here.


Kristin: there any medically 

Will: themed classical music? 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: There’s a good symphony that, um, where they reenact a bunch of stuff and there’s, like, there’s some stuff going on there. But, um, no, not an easy humming one, I would say. 

Will: Um, okay. Should we do one more? Uh, two more. Two more, okay. I got two more. Okay. Okay. No, let’s do one more.

Let’s put me out of my misery here. Oh, let’s try it. This one’s a children’s song. Okay. I’ll give you that clue. Okay. Hmm. Hmm. Hmm. Hmm. Head, shoulders, knees, and toes. Mm 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: hmm, mm hmm, mm hmm. Kristen, you’re killing it. 

Will: It’s [00:43:00] so good. Head, shoulders, knees, and toes. Knees and toes. Those are probably all, uh, joints that you’ve treated.

A head is not a joint. Well, except for the head. True. What’s your least favorite joint to inject? 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Ooh. Wow. Good point. Good question. That makes me 

Will: squirmy

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: even thinking about this one for a while. But at least, you know, most of the time you can’t do anything too wrong with a joint injection. I mean, you can, but it’s not like surgery. Yeah, 

Will: yeah, yeah. That’s true. Eventually the medication wears off, right? Yeah, exactly. That’s kind of the same thing with Botox, right?

If you screw up Botox. Yeah. 

Kristin: Eventually 

Will: it’ll go back to normal. It’ll go back to normal, so. It’ll be several 

Kristin: [00:44:00] months. Anyway, 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: yeah. Yeah, exactly. 

Will: For the record, I don’t do Botox, but, you know, I imagine that’s what it’s like. 

Kristin: Well, don’t you inject it in people’s eyes sometimes? 

Will: Well, yeah. No, I do, but. I haven’t in a long time.

I, I generally, we have a, we have an oculoplastic specialist that does all that stuff for us for the best. 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: I’ve heard that sometimes with severe eye twitching, people actually, if it won’t go away, they’ll actually do, do you do that? Or who does 

Will: that? It’s not even, so we do get, so I get patients every now and then they’ll come in and be like, my eyes, my eyelids twitching, like what can you do about it?

And most of the time, like, you’re not going to do anything about it because It’s, we all get that little mm-hmm. little. That’s annoying. It’s whenever you have like hemi facial spasm. Yeah. Where like you get you severe blepharospasm where the eyelids are just like squeezed so tight. The patient cannot get the eyelids open.

Those are the patients that you give Botox. What causes that? Um, you can get something called doco ectatic, uh, artery, uh, that will basically, it’s [00:45:00] an artery. Close to the facial nerve that has a strange course that will kind of rub up against the facial nerve and cause you to have a spasm Yeah, so that’s just one thing.

I don’t know. There’s probably others but this is this is boring But I, I do know, I don’t think I’ll be humming anymore for quite some time. No encore? Yeah, I think, you know, well, let’s, let’s leave the, the musical ability to people that actually know what they’re doing. Maybe, maybe next time though, I’ll, I’ll incorporate a little bit of Beethoven.


Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: exactly.

I don’t know. No, it’s the funniest thing. I swear with, with music, I focus so much, like so much on the melody. That my husband laughs at me because I just don’t even hear the words like when people start, you know, they’re all singing along Yeah, I have no idea but I’ll play along Play along the melody 

Will: Well, let’s uh, let’s take another break and then we will [00:46:00] be right back with dr.


All right, we are back. We’re going to go with, so we’re going to read some, a couple of fan stories from, uh, from, from some, from some of our listeners. I’m starting to lose the ability to talk here. All right. And, uh, we are going to react to these. I have not heard these stories. We’re going to react to them with Siobhan.

Who’s going to enjoy these, hopefully. So our first story comes from Jen. Um, let’s see, she says, this story is not the sort of thing. It says this story is probably not the sort of thing you’re after or it’s not weird or shocking and perhaps not many would find it hilarious. Good way to start a story. I thought I’d share it anyway as it involves ophthalmology and highlights one of the things I find amazing about medicine.

Uh, I’m a hospital pharmacist in Australia, and I used to work in a small tertiary hospital that specialized in only a few areas, one of which was ophthalmology. There were multiple sub specialist ophthalmology teams in the [00:47:00] hospital, including glaucoma, vitreoretinal, cornea, and oculoplastics. That’s actually one thing that people don’t realize about ophthalmology.

We have Like seven or eight subspecialties. Like you can choose a part of the eye that’s like 500 microns thick and specialize in that. It’s just outrageous. It’s crazy. Um, many of the patients who were admitted as inpatients were older and one day a patient admitted, was admitted under the cornea team, went into atrial fibrillation.

So, There’s a, a medical problem, a heart thing on an ophthalmology team. Not great. The corneal fellow approached me as the ward clinical pharmacist soon after with the following rapid fire exclamations. This patient is in a fib. I don’t know what to do. What should we do? Do we have digoxin? Apparently they did.

I specialize in the eye, and really only the front part of the eye. [00:48:00] The last line, last line makes me laugh whenever I think about it more than a decade later. That’s very true. That is absolutely something I would say. Yeah. What, what are you doing with an inpatient ophthalmology service? That’s it doesn’t, I don’t know if I’ve ever seen that.

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: I, we have, I’ve never heard of that in Canada ever. It’s amazing. It’s really hard to find an ophthalmologist who’s willing to come into the hospital. I got to say, 

Will: there are a few places in the U S that they have ophthalmology emergency rooms. 

Kristin: Oh, this is in Australia. So. Who know what they 

Will: have, who knows?

All right. If you know what, if you run an inpatient ophthalmology service, send me an email. Get in touch. Yeah, me touch. I have questions for you. All right. Thank you, Jen, for that one. Our second story comes from Alyssa, so she says, I have one story worth sharing. So she’s a personal support worker. I have one story worth sharing.

It’s not very long, but here it is. While waiting to interview for my home care job, I got to hear the gory details [00:49:00] of some patients. Anal cancer as he talked to the receptionist at the desk in the office. I was sitting in, he wasn’t even part of the agency, a patient of the agency. He was just somebody who just chatting 

Kristin: people up about his anal cancer 

Will: people up about, you know, what, if you got a good story to tell about your own personal medical history, you know, you’re going to tell the story.

You sure are. You sure. Thank you both for those stories. Uh, you can send us yours. Knock, knock high at human dash content. com. Um, Siobhan, thank you so much for joining us. Actually, one, one other quick question for you. Um, uh, have you, did you watch Succession? I’m sure you probably have, have, have heard this or gotten this question before.

Um, do you, how do you feel about it popularizing the, the name Siobhan? 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: It’s true. I have, I have mixed feelings on this, but I would say overall, it’s nice to get the name out there. I… I’m amazed how many people now will say Siobhan, [00:50:00] yes, from Succession. And people now, I think want to call me Shiv, but, uh, I don’t know.

I haven’t heard that since I was a little kid. Yeah, that’s 

Will: like a, that’s like a, a known nickname of Siobhan. Yeah. 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Yeah. I used to get Shiv, Shivy when I was a kid, but I haven’t 

Will: heard that in a really long time. Succession. Specific. I thought it was just like in that show. I It makes 

Kristin: me think of shanking people.


Will: Personally. Yeah, well, that’s what you, you shank someone with a shiv. 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: With a shiv. Yeah. Anyway, I moved away from that as I, you know, went to medicine. I figured it was not a good 

Kristin: look. There’s a certain personality that can pull that off. Yeah. Yeah. 

Will: Well, uh, so tell, uh, our listeners where to find you because I’m sure that everybody should be following you on, I’ll just, I’ll just spoil it.

You’re on YouTube and you have an amazing YouTube channel, um, at violin. md. 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: Yes, thank you so much. Yeah, I mean we have a lot more videos coming out excited about it And this has been so much fun. Like thank you so [00:51:00] much for inviting me. I just it’s been great chatting with you both of you Oh, it’s been 

Kristin: awesome.

Will: Yeah, really really fantastic content especially if you’re If you’re wanting, like, like real explanations where you can, like, understand things that happen about the human body and about diseases. And, uh, really, I admire your ability to connect with a general audience about a lot of these topics. That’s, that’s still very engaging and fun for a medical audience as well.

So. You’re certainly someone that I look up to on YouTube. So, um, uh, I just, I wish I could make engaging 15 minute videos, but You’d have to know more medicine. I would need to. Yes, that’s that’s that’s true. So keep up the awesome 

Dr. Siobhan Deshauer: work Oh, that’s so nice of you. Thank you so much. I really appreciate it 

Will: All right.

Take care

Well, that was a lot of fun talking to Dr. DeShower. Um, what a fascinating story. I love hearing the, the, the, the [00:52:00] arts and humanities coming into medicine, uh, violin. That just seems like a really hard instrument to play. 

Kristin: It does. And she started from such a young age. I kind of want to know. I mean, I kind of want to, but I’m also scared to know what if, what it sounds like when a four year old plays the violin, 

Will: well, you know, um, I don’t know, probably better than, than, than your humming that I, my humming and that I would sound right now if I picked up a violin, I don’t know, it’d be just as bad, if not worse.

Um, and, uh, let’s see. So tell us what you thought of the episode. If you have any, uh, guest suggestions, we’re happy to hear them. Uh, and you can always reach out to us, knock, knock high at human dash content. com. That’s our email. You can visit us on any of our social media platforms. We’re on all the things, all of them.

There’s like 15 of them. Just pick one and look for us. We’re there. You can hang out with us and our human content podcast family on Instagram and Tik TOK at human content pods. [00:53:00] Thanks to all the wonderful listeners leaving feedback, specifically the positive type of feedback. We really like that. Uh, especially on these reviews.

Kristin: Constructive criticism is okay. Sometimes, though, you know, it can be a little 

Will: spicy. Yeah, tell, respectfully, tell us what we can do better. Uh, and, um, if you subscribe and comment on your favorite podcasting app or on YouTube, we can give you a shout out. Like Carl, CarlYar5281 on YouTube commented on our recent episode with Linda Blustein.

One of my favorite YouTubers talking about hypermobility. This made my day. Mine too. Yeah, you really loved that one. I did. Full episodes of this podcast are up every week on my YouTube channel at DGlockenflecken. We also have a Patreon. Lots of cool perks, bonus episodes. Or where we, where we react to things.

I’m, I’m, I’m gonna get, I’m gonna make it. I’m gonna, we’re almost there. Uh, hang out with other members [00:54:00] of the Knock Knock High community. We are there and interacting and having fun. All right, don’t you want to have fun? Everybody needs to have a little fun. You get ad free episode access, early ad free episode access, interactive Q& A livestream events, and a lot more.

Patreon. com slash glock and Flickr or go to glock and Flickr. com. Speaking of Patreon community perks, new members, shout out to Marcella S Paul S and Christine. Oh. Thank you all. Welcome. Welcome to the team. Shout out to all the Jonathans, as always. We got Patrick, Lucia C, Sharon S, Omar, Edward K, Steven G, Roscox, Jonathan F, Marion W, Mr.

Grandaddy, Kaitlyn C, Brianna L, Dr. J, Chaver W, Jonathan A, Leah D, Kay L, Rachel L, and Ann P. Thank you all. A virtual Jonathan head nod to you all. Uh, and Patreon Roulette, shout out, random shout out to an emergency medicine tier patron. So, oh, I’ll try to do this correctly. You told me I sounded like a cat last time.

[00:55:00] So, oh. That’s a little bit more. That’s a little bit more 

Kristin: drum roll ish. 

Will: Shout out to Jacob A. for being a patron. Thank you, Jacob. Thank you for listening. We are your hosts, Will and Kristen Flannery, also known as the Glockenfleckens. A special thanks to our guest, Dr. Shaban Deshour, also known as ViolinMD on YouTube.

Check her out. Our executive producers are Will Flannery, Kristen Flannery, Aaron Corny, Rob Goldman, and Shanti Brooke. Our editor and engineer is Jason Portizzo. Our music is Omer Binzfi. To learn about our Knock Knock Highs, program disclaimer, ethics policy, submission verification, licensing terms, and hyper release terms, go to Glockenflaggen.

com or reach out to us at knockknockhighathuman content. com with any questions, concerns. Uh, fun medical puns, uh, uh, fun non medical puns, too, if you want, like, we’re willing to hear all of your jokes. Knock, knock, hi is a human content production.[00:56:00] 


Hey Kristen, do you know why I got into medicine in the first place? 

Kristin: To spend your evenings on documentation, of 

Will: course. Uh, no. Actually, that never even crossed my mind. I got into medicine to actually take care of patients. To, to be able to form relationships with them. That is a better reason. And care for them.

To listen to them. To actually look at their eyeballs while I’m treating their eyeballs. 

Kristin: Well, I would hope that you look at where you’re 

Will: treating. It’s an important part of being an ophthalmologist, and it’s easier than ever with the Nuance Dragon Ambient Experience, or DAX for short. This is AI powered ambient technology.

It’s just in the room with you, and it helps you be more efficient and reduce clinical documentation burden. It basically lets you get back to being a physician and practicing the way you want to practice. So it’s 

Kristin: like having a Jonathan. 

Will: To learn more about the Nuance Dragon Ambient Experience, or [00:57:00] DAX, visit nuance.

com slash discoverDAX. That’s N U A N C E dot com slash discoverDAX.